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    #16
    Originally posted by Daz-RSK View Post
    Unfortunately, Mick, I think that is a self perpetuating circle that you have landed on.

    I am not saying that holding onto a 55 yr old is not better for the environment than the ever churning cycle of new cars. New car production has a massive footprint.

    But you have to go back through a lot more time before you get right down the green credentials. A 65 Mustang probably replaced a car someone else driving at the time and those with inter war period motors probably were cursing new Mustang production then as not very green - if such a concept existed. Perhaps it didn't.

    What I am saying is that the greenest way forward is to buy a car at 16/17 and drive it to your grave, not its grave. That would be the cleanest way for sure. More people would look after their motor and make sure that it is able to withstand time. Car production would lower because demand would be lower. That is a good thing.

    We sell about 2.5mil new vehicles in the UK, give or take, per year. There are about 40/45 million drivers. So in 15/20 years we sell more vehicles than population that can drive. That's the issue.
    When my daughter was in school we composed an essay explaining how a 4.7 litre 65 Mustang was one of the greenest vehicles on the road based on through life considerations. For one thing it has not been scrapped and rebuilt three times. Its not got a lot of plastic in so there is little waste with scrapping. We mentioned that "zero emission" cars are not zero emission. they still deposit tyre and brake dust (and being on average heavier probably more than an ICE car). The teacher came back saying we were taking the micky but it only showed up the dangerous polarised views of some people.

    I kind of agree with Anaconda about driver less vehicles. Here we need to be more definitive between vehicles and cars. We do what we do because we enjoy driving our cars and appreciate the mechanical side of things. Autonomous vehicles are not cars to me they are just vehicles that look after themselves. For instance autonomous vehicles could make a lot of their journeys without people in them. If I had one and went shopping I would send it home after it dropped me off rather than pay a parking fee. It could then collect me when I required.
    Allan

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      #17
      Here we go. Let's put your minds at rest that autonomous driving is for someone else's lifetime. In the link attached, you'll find:-

      "Thatcham Research and the Association of British Insurers (ABI) have said they have serious concerns about this and warned that the plans threaten road safety"

      "The technology builds on existing lane-keeping systems that provide nominal assistance and will actually take over control of vehicles at low speeds, keeping them in lane on roads such as motorways."

      "Thatcham has found that Automated Lane Keeping Systems only meet 2 of 12 key principles to guarantee safety and has identified motoring scenarios in which lives will be put at risk, as Automated Lane Keeping System-equipped cars are bound by legislation that will not allow them to change lane autonomously."


      Bear in mind that this is only a lane keeping system that enhances on the lane keeping aid in vehicles today. We have not yet wandered into autonomous driving in totality yet!


      Great - so there are serious concerns in safety, yet more middle lane morons that won't get out of the way and stay in the wrong lane and the system only meets 2 of the 12 key principles based on safety!! The system doesn't understand that people walking on the highway (what they would be walking there, no one knows) and would just mow them down!

      Autonomous driving is for someone else's lifetime. Not mine!!

      https://fleetworld.co.uk/government-...lives-at-risk/

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        #18
        You're absolutely correct.
        Mass use of driverless vehicles will be as successful as the introduction of the flying car or personal jetpacks. They'll need to be so safe they'll never move. Pedestrians and cyclists doing their own thing will keep them stopped and gridlocked. The best you can hope for is some sort of segregated lane or track to keep them seperate from everything else.

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          #19
          You are all presuming the decision makers have some sort of common sense!
          Smart motorways, for example, are also a decision made by someone sat behind a desk and probably never driven on a motorway nevermind broken down on one, it's a scary place to be.
          Never underestimate the stupidity of intelligent people!

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